Comments on: A comedy of errors: Election 2006 http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/ Protect yourself from government gaffes, bureaucratic blunders and incumbent incompetence Mon, 06 Feb 2012 16:25:45 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Catelyn http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11992 Catelyn Sat, 25 Nov 2006 04:35:29 +0000 http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11992 If you wonder at all about the validity of accusations of miscalculations of votes, watch the HBO Documentary <i> Hacking Democracy </i>. It's scary how easy it is for the data to be altered, hacked, or otherwise manipulated. Everyone's vote is supposed to count, but in some cases this election it didn't count or was counted for the wrong person. If you wonder at all about the validity of accusations of miscalculations of votes, watch the HBO Documentary Hacking Democracy . It’s scary how easy it is for the data to be altered, hacked, or otherwise manipulated. Everyone’s vote is supposed to count, but in some cases this election it didn’t count or was counted for the wrong person.

]]> By: Dana Hanley http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11991 Dana Hanley Sat, 18 Nov 2006 03:22:22 +0000 http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11991 Admiral, I believe it is, "I am the mad midnight bomber what bombs at midnight," not "who." a bit OT, I think, but I'll take up any challenges on the old Tick cartoon series : ) Spoon! Admiral, I believe it is, “I am the mad midnight bomber what bombs at midnight,” not “who.”

a bit OT, I think, but I’ll take up any challenges on the old Tick cartoon series : )

Spoon!

]]> By: Crapulax http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11990 Crapulax Fri, 10 Nov 2006 20:04:14 +0000 http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11990 I can understand your concerns about electronic voting machines, about wether or not all the ballots are counted fairly, about intimidation, about the odd ridiculous situation that occurs, but let me just give you an outside point of view. You guys are close to 300 million now. Suppose (worst case scenarion) a 1% chance of anomaly, no matter the type of anomaly - that would yield 300 000 oddities. Even with a 0,1% chance of anomaly, that's still 30 000 events, which is actually a small enough percentage and overall, is a reliable election. But it's certainly a large enough number to attract media attention, especially since you always hear about what goes wrong, not about what goes right. So before you complain about unreliable elections, you must first look at the actual number of voters and the actual percentage of anomalies... which I unfortunately doubt would be published in the USA. So what it all boils down to, is wether or not you have faith in the overall election system. If you don't, any election becomes meaningless anyway, regardless of the number of mistakes made. If you do have faith, then you have to accept that no system is ever perfect and you're bound to have a number of mistakes (voting machines can be manipulated but so can election workers); just try to learn from them and keep them as low as possible. I would love to compare your average number of anomalies per election with ours, in Canada. We have just around 12% of your population so we're bound to have a lower number of mistakes than you would, but I'm sure our actual percentages of anomalies in relation to the number of votes would be similar to yours. I think that's a more revealing statistic... But there are two issues that few people seem to discuss in the US - voter eligibilty and voter turnout. You are the self-labeled largest democracy in the world... yet a 50% voter turnout is good in the USA. For us, if we go below 70% the media calls it a disaster. And how many people are denied their right to vote because of misdemeanor charges ? Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the right to vote determined by state laws instead of federal laws ? This would lead to voter rights that are not uniform across the land. Remember Florida in the 2000 presidential elections ? So the ultimate question is wether or not democracy means anything if a large part of the population either does not bother to vote or cannot vote for reasons that may be debatable. I'd question these points much more than the actual voting procedure. I can understand your concerns about electronic voting machines, about wether or not all the ballots are counted fairly, about intimidation, about the odd ridiculous situation that occurs, but let me just give you an outside point of view. You guys are close to 300 million now. Suppose (worst case scenarion) a 1% chance of anomaly, no matter the type of anomaly – that would yield 300 000 oddities. Even with a 0,1% chance of anomaly, that’s still 30 000 events, which is actually a small enough percentage and overall, is a reliable election. But it’s certainly a large enough number to attract media attention, especially since you always hear about what goes wrong, not about what goes right. So before you complain about unreliable elections, you must first look at the actual number of voters and the actual percentage of anomalies… which I unfortunately doubt would be published in the USA. So what it all boils down to, is wether or not you have faith in the overall election system. If you don’t, any election becomes meaningless anyway, regardless of the number of mistakes made. If you do have faith, then you have to accept that no system is ever perfect and you’re bound to have a number of mistakes (voting machines can be manipulated but so can election workers); just try to learn from them and keep them as low as possible.

I would love to compare your average number of anomalies per election with ours, in Canada. We have just around 12% of your population so we’re bound to have a lower number of mistakes than you would, but I’m sure our actual percentages of anomalies in relation to the number of votes would be similar to yours. I think that’s a more revealing statistic…

But there are two issues that few people seem to discuss in the US – voter eligibilty and voter turnout. You are the self-labeled largest democracy in the world… yet a 50% voter turnout is good in the USA. For us, if we go below 70% the media calls it a disaster. And how many people are denied their right to vote because of misdemeanor charges ? Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t the right to vote determined by state laws instead of federal laws ? This would lead to voter rights that are not uniform across the land. Remember Florida in the 2000 presidential elections ?

So the ultimate question is wether or not democracy means anything if a large part of the population either does not bother to vote or cannot vote for reasons that may be debatable. I’d question these points much more than the actual voting procedure.

]]> By: Michael Hampton http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11989 Michael Hampton Fri, 10 Nov 2006 00:44:08 +0000 http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11989 Huh? As bad as things are here already, you want them to get worse? Huh? As bad as things are here already, you want them to get worse?

]]> By: tjana stasni http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11988 tjana stasni Fri, 10 Nov 2006 00:36:40 +0000 http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11988 the american electoral system is a joke. the united nations should observe all future elections until the government is restructured in democratic fashion. that the rich christians can dominate the country and use it's military to open and maintain markets in third world countries is an abomination. i wish god existed. he would kick some ass! the american electoral system is a joke. the united nations should observe all future elections until the government is restructured in democratic fashion. that the rich christians can dominate the country and use it’s military to open and maintain markets in third world countries is an abomination. i wish god existed. he would kick some ass!

]]> By: C Brannon http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11987 C Brannon Thu, 09 Nov 2006 18:57:21 +0000 http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11987 Come on folks, Belchspeak is having more than is far share of speech here. He moans about how biased reporters of voting machine fraud are, without revealing unambiguously his own biases. As far as I know, he's a shill for Diebold, et. al. Give him no credibility. Come on folks, Belchspeak is having more than is far share of speech here. He moans about how biased reporters of voting machine fraud are, without revealing unambiguously his own biases. As far as I know, he’s a shill for Diebold, et. al. Give him no credibility.

]]> By: Michael Hampton http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11986 Michael Hampton Thu, 09 Nov 2006 16:02:05 +0000 http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11986 I actually caught the typo prior to publication and decided to leave it in anyway. And congratulations, you're our first IPv6 commenter! :) I actually caught the typo prior to publication and decided to leave it in anyway.

And congratulations, you’re our first IPv6 commenter! :)

]]> By: Valdis Kletnieks http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11985 Valdis Kletnieks Thu, 09 Nov 2006 15:59:29 +0000 http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11985 <blockquote>A Kentucky poll worker was charged with assault after attacking a voter whose ballot wouldn’t feed into the optical-scam machine.</blockquote> We have a winner for Fortuitous Typo of the Month! :)

A Kentucky poll worker was charged with assault after attacking a voter whose ballot wouldn’t feed into the optical-scam machine.

We have a winner for Fortuitous Typo of the Month! :)

]]> By: Tom K. http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11984 Tom K. Thu, 09 Nov 2006 13:35:22 +0000 http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11984 "Why has this burden of proof never been discussed prior to the introduction of electronic machines? And as a reminder, it is not the federal government, but the local government that is in charge of operating the electoral process." To answer your question in light of the following statement: Because for the first time, the ballots themselves are cast into a medium that is effectively a "black box" that the local election officials aren't aware of the contents of. Does the black box count the votes accurately, or does the black box flip every 20th Candidate X vote into a vote for Candidate Y? No way to tell unless we get rid of the black box. In this fundamental way, election results with (black box) E-voting machines is no longer strictly within the purview of local governments. Give me election machines running on locally provided computers using a fully open source voting software. That removes the obscurity of the black box. “Why has this burden of proof never been discussed prior to the introduction of electronic machines? And as a reminder, it is not the federal government, but the local government that is in charge of operating the electoral process.”

To answer your question in light of the following statement: Because for the first time, the ballots themselves are cast into a medium that is effectively a “black box” that the local election officials aren’t aware of the contents of.

Does the black box count the votes accurately, or does the black box flip every 20th Candidate X vote into a vote for Candidate Y? No way to tell unless we get rid of the black box. In this fundamental way, election results with (black box) E-voting machines is no longer strictly within the purview of local governments.

Give me election machines running on locally provided computers using a fully open source voting software. That removes the obscurity of the black box.

]]> By: Alex http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11982 Alex Thu, 09 Nov 2006 04:15:52 +0000 http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/08/a-comedy-of-errors-election-2006/#comment-11982 In a genuinely free society, if there's still a need for public elections, the burden of proof would be on the government to demonstrate that the election methods are verifiably fair. We are nowhere close... No tally counts of votes for comparison checks, and no receipts - in network protocols, this is called "send and pray"! Horrendous conflicts of interest among people executing the electoral process! Layers upon layers of bureaucracy to prevent recounts! Statistically impossible and historically unique discrepancies with exit polls! Hell, ballots found in trash cans! Any one of those things by itself should require a stern investigation and a complete re-vote in all affected precincts. In a genuinely free society, if there’s still a need for public elections, the burden of proof would be on the government to demonstrate that the election methods are verifiably fair.

We are nowhere close… No tally counts of votes for comparison checks, and no receipts – in network protocols, this is called “send and pray”! Horrendous conflicts of interest among people executing the electoral process! Layers upon layers of bureaucracy to prevent recounts! Statistically impossible and historically unique discrepancies with exit polls! Hell, ballots found in trash cans!

Any one of those things by itself should require a stern investigation and a complete re-vote in all affected precincts.

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